[pak64] City with no buildings May 09, 2009, 04:06:09 pm HelloNew player, first post.There are several cities on my map with no buildings or roads. Nothing. Yet they are in the city list and each has a population. Game details: Started 1800, 16 cities listed, 5 had buildings, 11 didn't and still don't. Year is 1806 now and everything is connected except the non cities. Largest 'non city' is Ashton with 4228 citizens making it the third largest..if it existed.Ive tried spending $5million to found a new city. It creates a new city right over the top of where the non city supposed to be, but it hasn't made the non city appear.How do I get the non cities to appear? Hope someone can help.Ta. Quote Selected Last Edit: May 09, 2009, 06:19:51 pm by Isaac.Eiland-Hall
Re: City with no buildings Reply #1 – May 09, 2009, 06:19:38 pm At this point, there's no way to get them to appear.The only way I've seen this happen was to have deleted the town halls for the cities by mistake -- apparently something removed them.Were the cities there from the time you started the map, or....?Also, what version of Simutrans are you running? There was a problem with this a number of versions ago, but it's long been fixed. Unless you somehow found a new bug. :-) Quote Selected
Re: [pak64] City with no buildings Reply #2 – May 09, 2009, 11:22:42 pm HelloI am playing version 102..downloaded a couple of weeks ago.The 'non' cities were not there at the start, well, I don't recall them. I ignored a couple of cities at first but they were there OK when I was ready to connect them a few years later. I haven't gone around deleting any buildings/town halls. The earliest save game that I have kept, 1802, didn't have any more cities than I have now (1806)One of the towns that is present has a road leading from it to the site of a 'non city'. No buildings of any kind exist at that location. I was hoping buildings would spring up over time like they did years ago in a similar game I used to play (Transport Tycoon).A development tonight in game was an industry 'Materialwholsale' appeared in the middle of nowhere yet right at the location of the biggest non city (pop 4228). In my limited game playing experience these usually pop up in towns rather than out in the countryside. Ive just connected services to it and hope that might generate some building/life to appear. But if I need a town hall I'm stuck.Now theres a thought...Town Halls. Do town hall buildings have date limits on when they can appear? If so, could the game randomly generate some town halls at game start which are too modern to be placed and thus cant start a town ?Hope that info makes sense.Its not spoiling the game. The build new city option will give me more towns when I want to buy them. Quote Selected
Re: [pak64] City with no buildings Reply #3 – May 10, 2009, 01:02:03 am The road leading to one indicates that the city (or 'ghost') was there at map creation, as that's the only time inter-city roads are built.Industry should appear in a city as it grows in size; industry appearing there implies to me that the city had grown, which is odd if you weren't serving the population-- but that begins to get a little past my limited technical knowledge of the Simutrans engine...Cities will not appear automatically, ever. Nor will things like rivers, or power plant chains (i.e. chains without a home city / end factory, which are created by the cities as they increase in size).The only two things I can think of that grow automatically are:- Cities- Factory chains built by cities that growEr, I got a little sidetracked, but I was intending to discuss servicing the Materialwholesale -- it will not cause a city to appear. From a game standpoint, I might recommend going ahead and creating a city where these ghost cities appear using public_player...Town hall buildings can have introduction dates, iirc; but I don't recall any problems anything like this that would make me suspect that to be an issue here... On the other hand, the only time I remember "ghost cities" was a bug related to removing cityhalls, which is why I'd asked about that ;-) -- but that bug was squashed long ago, so.... I'm at a loss. Quote Selected
Re: [pak64] City with no buildings Reply #4 – May 10, 2009, 08:36:25 am I wonder if you can start in 1800 at all. The game lets you of course, but there might simply be no houses or townhall available at this time. Quote Selected
Re: [pak64] City with no buildings Reply #5 – May 10, 2009, 06:43:55 pm The problem is the following: When simutrans creates a new city, the town hall is built first. But it doesn't care, if it could build no townhall... This could also be considered to be a pak set error, but imho simutrans should use an other town hall in this case (even if it doesn't fit the timeline).Patch attached. Quote Selected
Re: [pak64] City with no buildings Reply #6 – May 13, 2009, 06:38:55 am Thank you for the replies and patch. gerw: If I patch will it work on the save game in progress?There are houses and townhalls available in 1800. The game started with four cities on the map.In play since my last post I have serviced the Materialwholesale that sprung up at the location of the biggest non city..Ashton. (I couldn't seem to generate any mail or p****engers). Soon after a second Materialwholesale appeared. So now all there was at the location was my road, two Materialwholesale and lots of green space. A few hours later loads of buildings had appeared..but no town name, no town hall. Quote Selected
Re: [pak64] City with no buildings Reply #7 – May 13, 2009, 06:44:54 am Quote from: Severous – on May 13, 2009, 06:38:55 amIf I patch will it work on the save game in progress?No, it will only affect new games.QuoteThere are houses and townhalls available in 1800. The game started with four cities on the map.I think, there aren't townhalls for all climates.QuoteIn play since my last post I have serviced the Materialwholesale that sprung up at the location of the biggest non city..Ashton. (I couldn't seem to generate any mail or p****engers). Soon after a second Materialwholesale appeared. So now all there was at the location was my road, two Materialwholesale and lots of green space. A few hours later loads of buildings had appeared..but no town name, no town hall.Imho this is due to the cityrules - maybe the Materialwholesale count as a normal city building and so the city started to build other houses. Quote Selected
Re: [pak64] City with no buildings Reply #8 – May 13, 2009, 12:45:23 pm With non-matching climates there should be no townhall and then no city. Or the code that check this is broken. Quote Selected
Re: [pak64] City with no buildings Reply #9 – May 13, 2009, 01:06:55 pm But then, stadt_t::random_place has to consider also the timeline (insert welt->get_timeline_year_month() in simcity.cc:2418).Current behaviour is:A city can build in a climate, if there is a townhall for this climate at _any_ time. Quote Selected
Re: [pak64] City with no buildings Reply #10 – May 14, 2009, 08:51:45 am Then this is a bug ... Quote Selected
Re: [pak64] City with no buildings Reply #11 – May 14, 2009, 09:19:05 am Patch attached. Quote Selected
Re: [pak64] City with no buildings Reply #12 – May 14, 2009, 09:34:25 am I encountered a city with no buildings once, but under different circumstances. That city does not have any space around its town hall to add city buildings or extend its 2-tile road due to surrounding rivers and slopes, so no matter how large the population size grow, there is no city building. I wonder if city placement could be modified to prevent such awkward town hall location, and maybe it's worthwhile to limit city growth if there is no space for new city buildings and if all buildings have already reached their max level. Quote Selected
Re: [pak64] City with no buildings Reply #13 – June 02, 2009, 09:11:40 pm Was this included? gerw, could you post your patch again? Quote Selected
Re: [pak64] City with no buildings Reply #14 – June 03, 2009, 06:42:53 am No, it wasn't.You can find it atwww.tu-chemnitz.de/~gerw/patches/ghost_cities_v2.patch Quote Selected Last Edit: June 03, 2009, 06:49:24 am by gerw
Re: [pak64] City with no buildings Reply #15 – June 20, 2009, 12:38:26 pm HiI did not patch nor restart. I played on with my 1800 PAK64 V102 game that lacked so many cities due to the town hall/time line bug.Ive found a way to get the missing villages to appear.Place your HQ within the city limits and provide transport. The HQ generates p****engers and this starts the normal growth process. Within days the city started appearing.Here's the example. Renborough city limits is part on land and part sea. There is no town hall nor city buildings. There hasn't been anything at any time since the game started 15years ago. Just a nearby tourist attraction which I service via ship. I tried extending the stop so part was inside city limits but that had no effect.Built my HQ inside city limits. The population of the city instantly jumped by 606 and normal city activity started. People walk around and the city window shows travels and p****enger stats occurring for the first time.Within 3 days other buildings appear. I will give it a month or so then move the HQ to one of the other locations where no city buildings have ever appeared. Quote Selected
Re: [pak64] City with no buildings Reply #16 – June 20, 2009, 07:42:45 pm Should not occur on newer nightlies anyway. Quote Selected
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